The End - 2000 to 2009

Would we, as Muslims, live happily under an Islamic State?

  • Author: MR
  • Filed under: Islam
  • Date: May 12,2006 | 04:10 PM

I was thinking about this the other day. What would it be like to live under an Islamic government. To live in an Islamic country, an Islamic environment, where everything is ruled by the Qur’an and sunnah. I know you must be thinking it is like living during the time of the Prophet (saas) when they were living in Medina, but yet that was during that time. Now there are many different rulings, different opinions, different beliefs and understandings of what Islam is and should be. How would we all get along together in an Islamic state or we would still be divided amongst ourselves, even if we are ruled by ourselves? Is an Islamic state just a dream?

What about the many thigns we enjoy that aren’t so ‘halal’, so to speak. Like movies, computer games, TV shows, sports, games, etc. All those recreational things which young Muslims all over the world, including Muslim countries, enjoy. Would be able to go see Harry Potter or X-Men 3 under an Islamic State? What about playing basketball in the middle of the night? What about our MSAs? Conferences? Lectures? All these things which we all enjoy now, would they be still available for us under an Islamic state.

What am I getting at? Our hearts are diseased with pleasing ourselves. We don’t have enough love and want for akhirah (hereafter). We should all be happy under an Islamic state. We should be happy that we can please Allah to our best capabilities almost to the likeness of the sahabas (companions of the Prophet) and the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him).

The point: with all the good, halal fun, not-so-halal fun, and fun, all is temporary, the real fun is in jannah (heaven).

May Allah (subhanhu wa ta’ala) grant us all jannah (heaven)! May He forgive us of all of our sins! May He put love for Islam and love for Him and His beloved Prophet (peace be upon him) into our hearts! May He allow us to enjoy what is halal in this world and that is pleasing to him! Ameen!


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  • 33 Responses for "Would we, as Muslims, live happily under an Islamic State?"

    1. Azeem May 12th, 2006 at 4:34 pm

      mashallah, great reflection.. I actually thought about that before…

      Brothers want an Islamic State.. but if the Khaleefah ordered them to destroy all cigarettes and sheesha bars would they be ready to?

      I also thought about the DVDs…. right now MILLIONS of dollars are spent to make movies. Imagine the Islamic State (Khaleefa + shura + whoever else is in authority) decided that this is a wastage of resources and hollywood should be shut down… I dont think alot of Muslims would like that…

      Also a big problem with picturing what a modern day khilafah would be like is that we are afraid there will be an attempt to turn back time, bring out the camels, and force people to only eat dates for dinner. Some people picture it like going to tableegh coming back and finding the whole world is on that same tip. (I mean in terms of what things might look/feel like).

      I think if we ever have a khilafah it must be Web 2.0, in other words up to date, in tune with the world today, and it should be understanding of the lifestyles that we grew up in, and should just work to purify that if needed.

      sorry … rambling…

    2. erm May 12th, 2006 at 7:12 pm

      Of course if the khlifah did actually live n rule by Islam then it would not be outdated…Islam is for all time for all people…
      does anyone know how the Khilfah ended in the first place…ie the history?and source plz

    3. W Ali May 12th, 2006 at 9:20 pm

      In reply to the question of the caliphate.

      The caliphate was formally abolished soon after the first world war by kemal ataturk, the reformist president of turkey. understand at this time that turkey had just faced one of it’s greatest embarrassments in the first world war, having sided with the axis powers and coming out conquered and divided. leading up to the world war, turkey, or the ottoman empire as it was then known as was called the ‘sick man of europe’ because of it’s obviously declining power. in a vain attempt to regain some of its composure and previous grandeur to its once magestic empire, turkey sided with the axis and lost the war along with germany and italy. soon after this, the ottoman empire was easily abolished and portioned out by the west. also at this time kemal ataturk came into power. his zeal to secularize turkey, the seat of the surviving caliphate, as well as his stringent efforts to integrate turkey into the west found no place for the caliphate and so it was abolished officially in 1924, power being handed over to the trukish parliament, where it has remained so for the last 80 years.

      you can easily find sources all over the net and in bookstores about the decline of the ottomans, which essentially spells out the decline of the caliphate as well.

      hope that helps:)

    4. haseeb May 12th, 2006 at 10:49 pm

      its easy to summarize huge historical events within a paragraph, isnt it?

      You want to learn Islamic History, and about the fall of the caliphate?

      HEres a start:

      Imam Zaid Shakir – The Rise and Fall of the Ummah

    5. Yaser May 13th, 2006 at 12:36 am

      Very reflective post. Shows how much work we need to do since we think we want certain things, but we are still unwilling to leave what we know what we’re supposed to leave.

    6. Random May 13th, 2006 at 10:16 am

      Some Muslim intellectuals actually ‘question’ the possibility of aiming to build a purely Islamic state, similar to the theocracy of the Prophet (SAW)’s time. Perhaps this is because they know that it is practically impossible to, say, remove all Bollywood/Hollywood movies and musics from an entire nation, or, for that matter, expect the ppl living under this theocracy to wholly and sincerely submit to the systems of such a state. Reza Aslan, for one, thinks theocracy is a big ‘no-no’. But then again, the Islamic lifestyle was also considered ‘weird/unacceptable/boring/not-fun’ during the Prophet (SAW)’s time, and the Islamic society alien to practically every other society. Islam is not just a ‘spiritual/religoius’ aspect of our life–its embodies every aspect: Political, social, economic, emotional AND spiritual. But many of us, today, though willing to include it in our spiritual lives, are not ready to see it as political, social, economic system, ruling our lives. And this is probably because of our lack of faith? or are there other factors involved?

      I think u raise very important points in ur post that has some serious implications on the Muslim Ummah today. I think its become more important than ever, for us to stop and reflect, and study Islamic history. I dont think we need to ‘modernize’ Islam, or get it to ‘fit in’ to satisfy our wants and needs. Rather, we need to revert back to the old ways, minus the camels, the dates, and the love for this world.

    7. Mujahideen Ryder May 13th, 2006 at 12:02 pm

      Random – “minus the camels” = updating Islam or ‘modernizing’ Islam.

      Islam is for all people and all times. It was updated right when the Prophet (peace be upon him) and when the 2nd Caliph came in, and the 3rd and 4th. You are right, that we need to learn and study Islamic history because it shows us how Islam evovles, updates and modernizes itself through the Qur’an and sunnah.

    8. elefantebianco May 13th, 2006 at 12:50 pm

      salaams akhi…wow this is a very intresting thought…we all say we want an islamic state but you are right can we really live underone…or is our nafs to fat (due to us continously feeding our desires) that we would not be able to have the patience and self restraint…

      hmmm movies…well look at this way…some are really good atleast this way they wouldnt have any haraam bits init…i do not feel all movies would be band…just those that promote haraam…for movies are a brilliant way to provoke and wake up people when it comes to certain issues…im talkin about documentary types like the road to guantanamo…and bradford riots…not sure if you have seen these in the states as well as hollywood movies…like million dollar baby…constant gardner…and many others that make you think…not just the action packed that you come out saying oh that was really cool…or the chick flicks that you come out saying aww…but the ones that make you want to make a change to the continous injustice that is taking place around the wolrd…the ones that have you gripping your seats out of fear, disgust…and general discomfort to know that there are others that are not watching this through a tv screen but are there watching it happen…i feel such movies would not be banned…and niether will playing basketball at midnight…not that i do that…but i see no wrong in that…but i think things like the OC, prison break may be banned…as for ps2 and 3 and xboxs…they might be seen as a waste of time…and the games that promote un nessary violence probably would be…

      thoughts from your sister in London

    9. striving.... May 13th, 2006 at 12:58 pm

      In order to have some Muslim state, it can’t come out of nowhere…I mean, there has to be some type of uprise and wanting for such a state, people will ultimately have to become more aware of their less halal lifestyles and want a better way to raise their children and a better environment for their families and therefore would be more willing to abandon their old ways. If there isn’t anybody willing to forget these things and pursue a life in the way of Allah then it’s not like some Islamic state can just form…it has to have it’s backing..and if we ever reach the point where such a state is possible, insha’Allah, it would be through scholars and shayukh reminding us of our purpose and the importance of this deen and I think then more people would be willing to give up their music and video games…Islam and a better relationship with Allah provide us with a much more fulfilling and satisfying feeling than any game can ever achieve. (I don’t know if this at all made sense…my rambling)
      Allah alone knows best.
      May we always strive to please Allah.
      Ameen!

    10. W Ali May 13th, 2006 at 1:28 pm

      you’re right hasseb, you can’t summarize a major event like that in one paragraph, my mistake.

    11. Munzareen May 13th, 2006 at 7:10 pm

      If we want an Islamic state, we must change ourselves. Allah doesn’t raise the status of a people unless they change themselves. We would need to make sincere intention for the pleasure of Allah. I’ve come to a realization that the things I do today (example watch TV) will be decreasing and probably won’t exist to the same extent they have in my childhood. Besides movies having haraam themes, think of how much we sin by watching a movie period— in the sense that men get one glance at women, but TV is a prolonged look and the girl is revealing her awrah (be it hair, arm, necks, legs). Same thing goes for girls, there are things even we should not see on television.

      We need to purify our hearts above all. We’ve become desensitized to everything we see. It doesn’t even phase us that something might be sinful.

      I don’t think all media entertainment would be banned, but come on.. Have you seen how much more provactive and vulgar television has gotten just in OUR time? Some things NEED to be banned. But like you can’t completely restrict a young child without giving them love, we need to seriously, seriously check our intentions and look inside our hearts. Do we control our nafs? More often than not, no. You cannot change the world if unwilling to change yourself.

      May Allah make us among those with pure intention. May we live our lives in His service and never forget our purpose here on earth. May our hearts become pure and may we be raised in ranks. Ameen.

    12. mujahideenryder May 13th, 2006 at 11:21 pm

      More thinking about this:

      What about professional sports like the NBA or MLB? Oh man!

      Anyways I also thought of a solution:

      Islamic state, but with non-Muslims living here also, free to do their business (making movies, games, music, etc.).

      Haha, astagfirAllah…j/k
      😀

    13. mbslrm May 14th, 2006 at 12:00 am

      I really don’t know.

    14. haseeb May 14th, 2006 at 1:13 am

      no mulla is taking my mlb/nfl/nba away from me :)

      in the end ppl are gonna do whatever they want anyway. the nafs is very powerful unfortunately

    15. elefantebianco May 14th, 2006 at 8:25 am

      salams,

      i really dnt understand why you think…basket ball would be banned in the first place…its healthy, keeps people fit and its not haraam to enjoy yourself….so why would it be banned…they would just make you stop and pray if prayer time came and stuff…and their would be no cheerleaders (not sure if you have them) but you get what im trying to say…why would you think it would be banned…

    16. Munzareen May 14th, 2006 at 12:02 pm

      elefante bianco is right… as long as the shorts are long enough and girls aren’t coming to watch your games, wouldn’t that be ok?

      unless you’re talking about not just playing amongst yourselves bu watching nba LIVE.. which still should be okay as long as there aren’t girls there…hah.. sounds so weird COMING from a girl, but it’s true

    17. myextendedfamilymate May 14th, 2006 at 1:13 pm

      This is an interesting article. I never thought of all the things that we do that the Prophet (AS) never did (consciously, that is).

      However, we are on this planet to worship Allah, and Him only. so we must kick our desires to the curb and battle shaytan and get real. if it takes an islamic state to do so, i’m all for it.

      goodbye tv, computer!! i’ll miss you in this life, but i’ll catch up with ya in da hear after.

    18. myextendedfamilymate May 14th, 2006 at 1:14 pm

      btw, i love this site so much more. its more organized

    19. rooq May 14th, 2006 at 1:33 pm

      Oh man, yeah I’ve wondered the same thing too. We know establishing the Khilafah is the ideal situation, but the transition would definitely be difficult. In the end, I guess you just have to keep in mind that Allah (swt) knows best for all of us.

      May Allah (swt) help rid us of our attachments to the dunya, and grant us success and happiness in this life and the akhirah. Ameen.

    20. Mujahideen Ryder May 14th, 2006 at 1:51 pm

      myextendedfamilymate – thanks

      elefantebianco – i didn’t say playing basketball was haram, i just said playing it in the middle of the night, meaning if the rulers set a curefew for all people, they can’t be out at night, unless going to the masjid or something. thats what i meant.

      but in all honesty, an islamic state is a dream right now, we have at least couple 100 steps before that stage.

    21. Debbie May 14th, 2006 at 9:19 pm

      Very interesting topic and the comments are excellent. As a Christian I find it very healthy for discussions like this for Muslims and for Christians.

      We spend too much time with all that modern technology has given us, even though we believe that the knowledge to create that technology comes from God. We should set these things aside and spend more time worshiping, praying and studying the Bible, what we consider God’s Word to us. Also more time should be spent helping our fellow mankind on this earth.

    22. Refai May 14th, 2006 at 10:30 pm

      AA, I don’t think the point of an Islamic state would be to provide a watchdog over our lives to make sure that no one ever commits a haram act. That would completely violate the Islamic principle of individual responsibility for your actions. Even during the Prophet (saw)’s time, there were many people who committed many crimes and were never punished for them. Of course, Allah could have sent down revelation or informed his messenger, but Allah did not. They will be responsible for what they did in the next life.

      At the same time, the Muslim State is not permitted to spy on its citizens as the US government does flagrantly to us. Please see this article for more information on the prohibition. When Umar (ra) was caliph, he once passed by a man who used to have huge parties with alcohol (kind of like a big frat party) and he could smell the alcohol from the street. He knocked at the door and asked permission to enter. Realising it was the head of state himself they refused to open. Umar went round the back of the house and climbed over. He confronted them that he has caught them drinking. They admitted that they were drinking but then said ‘we have committed one wrong, but Umar (ra) has committed three:’
      1) spying on them, 2) coming in without permission and 3) coming into a house from behind, quoting the relevant verses of the Qur’an. Umar conceded and left them alone! Although they were wrong, so too was Umar (ra) in trying to find out what wrong they were doing.

      Islam never tells us to go behind people and see what wrong they do. Sometimes when people would admit to the Prophet (saw), he wouldn’t even want to hear it out of his mercy. There isn’t a lot of mercy among Muslims today. Maybe that’s why Allah has not given us an Islamic state yet. Maybe it is because we are not ready. The goal of the Islamic state is to call people to the just and stable social order of Shariah, which is much more than just rules and punishments. I encourage everyone to read a translation of Al-Mawardi’s writing on this.

    23. mujahideenryder May 14th, 2006 at 11:46 pm

      mashaAllah!

      JazakumaAllah khair Refai!!! That was an amazing read.

    24. anon May 15th, 2006 at 7:03 am

      I second that!

    25. Abdulrahman Hilmi May 15th, 2006 at 1:24 pm

      Assalamu alaikum
      First we need to know what the problem is. Why is it that we need a Khilafah, or do we even need one? What is it that is a problem today that requires us to establish a Khilafah so that this problem could be solved?

      Now you raised a good point brother, alot of Muslims (but certainly not all) are not in touch with their deen as they should be. So over here, it is a problem of education, is it not? A problem that Muslims today are not educated and taught in their deen to create the love and awe towards Allah like they should. I heard other Muslims saying that our problem is that there is too much war and no stability. Other Muslims say that all Muslim countries (with absolutly no exception) are being ruled by oppresive governments. So there are alot of problems and everyone prioroties differently. But for now, I will consider only what you stated to be the main problem (and personally, I agree with you that this is indeed the most important problem), that Muslims need to be taught of their deen.

      OK, so what is the solution? Well, to try and find a solution we need to know what is causing this problem in first place. You can spend all your life trying to educate every single Muslim, but if the cause of the problem is not solved, the problem will always be there. Take for example Niger. The majority of the people there are starving and yet there are stores right next to them filled with food. The problem is obviously not the lack food, the problem is a problem of destribution of food and government efficiency.

      Going back to the main issue at hand, we ask ourselves, why are Muslims not being taught their deen like they should. Why isn’t there that vibrant love and submission towards Allah and his messenger (pbuh)? Well, what is education? Is it only what we learn in school? Is it parent’s teachings AND schools? Is it parent’s teachings, schools AND the community the people live with? Is it the parent’s teachings, schools, community and the whole surrounding environment and society? I think the last one defines education best. Education is absolutly everything that enters our minds to form concepts and ideas in our heads. All our actions, absolutly all our actions are based on thoughts. They are based on concepts that we hold. If I have a concept towards Ali that he is an honest man and I have another concept towards Omar that he is a wicked man, then my actions towards Ali will be different from that towards Omar. My concepts towards Ali and Omar are not built on simply what I am told. It is built on what I see, what I hear, the way I think and how I react to different circumstances. All these things build on our minds to creat concepts, ideas and thoughts which are the basis of our actions.

      To make what I am saying more direct, the environment and everything it contains, including schools, universities, what we see on TV, advertisments, the way people dress in the street, what stores sell, what is acceptable in a society and what is frowned upon, what is looked up towards and what is laughed at, all these things build on us to form the man that we become. All these things effect us differently as well to make us each a unique human being, and yet, not different from those within that had similar life experiences.

      I would like to put another point to support my idea. If we know that Allah revealed the Sharia as rules for us to implement, then allow me to ask the question, why? Why did Allah, for example, tell us to cut the hand of the theaf? Is it not because Allah knows that this is the most effect law to the problem of theft, and Allah knows best? So when considering all the shariah laws, it is obvious to us that Allah revealed them so that we can have the best society we can possibly have on Earth. So in other words, if the Shariah laws are implemented, the society will be fixed because that is the purpose of the those laws. To say that we can fix the people (and thus the society) without implementing the shariah is similar to saying that we don’t need to implement the shariah at all as we can solve our problems without it.

      The question is, can we solve the problems of Muslims without the shariah laws or do we need to have the shariah laws to solve our problems?

      btw, when I say shariah, I mean the judiciary and criminal laws part of the shariah.

      wasallamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuh.

    26. Debbie May 16th, 2006 at 8:42 am

      Very interesting conversation.

    27. Unknown May 19th, 2006 at 12:50 am

      Shaykh ‘Abdullah ‘Azzam said, “We do not wait for the Caliphate to be restored. Because, the Caliphate does not return through abstract theories, amassed knowledge and studying. Rather, jihad is the right way to reform the divided authorities to the ultimate authority of the Caliphate.”

    28. Abdulrahman Hilmi May 19th, 2006 at 5:19 am

      Assalamu alaykum brother unknown,
      if by Jihad you mean armed struggle, I have to disagree with you. There are very few, if any, moments in the history of the world did a people ever change systems that ruled them through armed struggle. And this inculdes our beloved prophet peace be upon him. Even though Hamza (raa) asked the prophet (pbuh) several times to attack Quraish, the prophet kept on telling him to be patient and wait. It was not until the prophet (pbuh) established the Islamic state in Madinah that he finally organised an army and and sent messengers and armies to Rome, Persia, Yemen and several other tribes within Arabia. All under the banner of Islam. This is even during a time when the authority of one man (the prophet pbuh) over the Muslim was clear and undisputed, how do you think it will be when the Muslims are divided and have absolutly no authority of an ameer over them?

      The way to establish a Caliphate is the way the prophet did it and the most successful method that has been used throughout history. Edward Luttwak said in his book Coup d’Etat, “More governments are changed by coup d’etat than by elections”. The prophet did not enter Madinah through war, but only entered it when he got the baia’a (pledge) from the two tribes Awes and Khazraj. Getting those pledges from them made him undisputed in his influence over Madinah and therefor he took over leadership then from another man (who I can’t remember his name now) who was so rich and powerful, he was the first authority in the whole of Madinah.

      Therefor the way should be to find nusra, some people that if they joined the struggle to establish the caliphate, they will tip the balance to our side. People influencial in the government, the army, the civil service, etc.

      and Allah knows best.
      wassalamu alaikum

    29. Unknown May 19th, 2006 at 1:06 pm

      Go ahead and leave out all the battles of the Prophet (saw) before Fath al Mecca.

      Allah commanded them to be patient in the early years of Mecca; but then fighting became fard on the Muslims (Kutiba ‘alaykumul Qitaal). The ayaat on “fight those who fight you” cannot be disregarded as just an asbabul nuzool without direct guidance in today’s world.

      If you give up Jihad, Allah will make disgrace prevail over you:

      Narrated by Abdullah ibn Umar: I heard the Apostle of Allah, (sallallahu ‘alayhe wassallam) say: “When you enter into a transaction, hold the tails of cows, are pleased with agriculture, and give up conducting jihad, Allah will make disgrace prevail over you, and will not withdraw it until you return to your original Deen (i.e., True Islam).” Sunan Abu Dawud: Book 23, Number 3455

      I don’t know what history you are talking about brother. How do you think Islam spread from the Arabian Peninsula throughout a great portion of the globe? Beautiful Lectures? Conferences? Demonstrations? Screaming in public?

      I advise you to study the lives of the 4 Caliphs and their command on Jihad and their participation in them.

    30. Abdulrahman Hilmi May 19th, 2006 at 7:42 pm

      Assalamu alaikum my dear brother
      I never ignored the battles before fatih mecca. My question is, were there any battles before the Hijra to Medinah? No there weren’t.

      As for the method to re-establish the state, I never said that we do it through lectures, conferences or demonstrations. I said clearly we do it by overthrowing the tyrants and dictators, but we do it through peaceful means like the prophet did. No where in the Quran nor the Sunnah can you bring me a proof that we are allowed to establish armed militias in Islam. The only army that is allowed to exist is that under the leadership of a Khaleefah. Unless, ofcourse, I am missinformed, in which case please correct me.

      Wassalamu alaikum

    31. summaya October 16th, 2006 at 8:19 pm

      what a debate!!! i always thought offensive jihad couldn’t be done without a state to lead it anyway? so before we can do such jihad, the khilafah needs to be in place!!

    32. Mujahideen Ryder’s Blog - Not the average Muslim blog… » Who would rule an Islamic State? January 8th, 2007 at 12:14 pm

      […] Who would rule an Islamic State? If you remember a while back I wrote a post entitled Would we as Muslims live happily under an Islamic Sate. Basically I was thinking about if we would be able to do the simple fun things we do (playing sports, eating out late at night, watching movies) in an Islamic state. […]

    33. Azul February 3rd, 2009 at 10:12 pm

      Tyranny and oppresive regimes are all we would face under a world ruled by islamic law. The sheiks murdered the true followers of Muhammed and inserted their bile and control in place of faith and truth. World wide it is nothing but a virulent controling sham of what Muhammad taught. I pray for you all.

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