The End - 2000 to 2009

Sh. Abdullah Hakim Quick joins AlMaghrib Institute

AlMaghrib Institute is the new scholar monopoly! haha. Shaykh Muhammad AlShareef writes:

Allahu akbar!

This annoucement for me is like when your local sports team announces that one of the greatest players in the game is now going to be wearing your jersey. (My heart is beating fast right now with excitment)

When I was very young, little kid in a Masjid in Winnipeg, the uncles gathered the youth together for a lecture from this vising speaker from Toronto. I loved his lecture, and I was so impressed that he was using names and terms that I, as a kid, was familiar with. (come to think of it, that may be the first time I was exposed to that style, it became my style years later). It was sh.Abdullah Hakim Quick.

Recently, I’ve been to a half dozen or so conferences with sh.Abdullah Hakim Quick was also one of the speakers. I find that when there is a crowded room at these conferences and you are looking for someone familiar, someone comfortable, someone you know you can enjoy your evening sitting beside and discussing things with … I will always gravitate to sh.Abdullah Hakim Quick (and alhamdulillah, I hope I’ve read it correctly, he also enjoys my company in the same way. At least I hope so, lol.)

Here is his bio:

Abdullah Hakim Quick was born in the United States and accepted Islam in Canada in 1970. He graduated from the College of Da‘wah and Usul al-Din at the Islamic University of Medina in 1979. He obtained an M.A. and a PhD in African history at the University of Toronto, where he examined the life of the West African scholar and social activist, Usman Dan Fodio A. H. Quick has been a teacher and counsellor in Canada, the United States, and the West Indies. He has travelled to more than 55 countries around the world teaching and doing research.

Currently, he is Senior Lecturer at The True Dawn Institute and a member of the Muslim Judicial Council. He is also Director of the Discover Islam Centre in Cape Town, South Africa

You have seen him on TV: Islam channel, Huda TV, Peace TV.
You have seen him in conferences the world over: Canada, USA, UK, Dr.Zakir’s conference in India, Australia.

And now, you will get to learn from him from the comfort of your AlMaghrib chairs!

Please join with me in giving the biggest ever welcome to your new AlMaghrib instructor: Sh.Abdullah Hakim Quick!

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  • 22 Responses for "Sh. Abdullah Hakim Quick joins AlMaghrib Institute"

    1. Swarth Moor September 10th, 2009 at 1:25 pm

      I know that i can’t be the only one in the Islamic blogosphere who sees that there is a problem here. One of the primary principles of this Deen is to enjoin the good and forbid the wrong. We have two, or one may say, three trends taking place here. These positions, in spite of what some “pledge” may claim, are irreconcilable.

      Let’s start from the top and be blunt about it. The Maghrib Institute is a Wahhabi institute. Now before the pseudo-salafis start lying and saying there is no such thing as a “Wahhabi,” this was the name given to the movement by the Sunnis when this movement arose from the accursed region of Najd. By “Wahhabi,” i mean those who follow Muhammad ibn Abdul-Wahhab and believe in the anthropomorphic teachings of that movement. It is the Wahhabis, who pray to a giant corporeal smiling faced entity, with a tibia, a pair of relatively small feet, eyes and fingers, who moves up and down, sits in person, and mounts the Ceiling of Paradise (the `Arsh). The Sunnis have deemed this outrageous belief kufr.

      On the other hand, there are those who claim to be “traditionalist” Muslims who follow a madhhab and one of the two schools of Sunni theology (Ash`ari or Maturidi). These people have gained almost rock star status among some Muslims. Nonetheless, these same “rock stars” have made claims, such as:

      —-“the Hurul-`Ayn” (Virgins of Paradise) are figurative,

      —that murder interupts the predestined deathtime of a person (this is outright kufr, for nothing alters that which Allah has predestined)

      —that we are “the children of Allah,” (on at least two, although i heard from someone else on at least three occassions)

      —that (one of these quasi-scholars) does not know what happens to the kaafir when he dies (and refers to kaafirs as “martyrs”)

      —there is no martial jihaad mentioned in the Qur’an

      —in an interview with Bill Moyer one of these (so-called) “scholars” for dollars just outright denies and rejects a verse in the Qur’an (whose meaning is commonly known by any student of knowledge)

      —claims that we cannot call a person a “kaafir” because we do not know what state a person will die upon (this is a lie–we judge a person based upon their current condition)

      —cannot even give a clear unambiguous definition of who a kaafir is and what is their destination in the Hereafter—-In essence, there is a trend among these quasi-traditionalists to obliterate the entire notion of kufr (disbelief) and riddah (apostasy) from the minds of Muslims (so that they (these swindlers) won’t be challenged in their misguidance/kufr)

      —another one of these “scholars” oversaw a Ph. D. dissertation that attempts to prove that “the original Asiatic blackman is Allah,” (by some twisted line of logic that since the early Muslims (allegedly) had anthropomorphic notions about Allah, and that the original inhabitants of Arabia were allegedly black, ergo, Allah is a “blackman.”) This same “scholar” said in one of his books that it is not important for African-American Muslims to study the matters of `Aqidah.

      —then we have one of the former Maghrib teachers asking Allah to have mercy on a well-known (dead) deviant, who denied the miracles of the Prophets, denied the existence of the jinn, claimed that the accountable Christians are not condemned to Hell, that the Christian male can marry the Muslim female, etc. Even some of his (now former?) students couldn’t wrap their minds around that–for they said that they learned FROM HIM that the one who does the above commits kufr (i.e., denies what is necessarily known in the Deen), and one cannot ask Allah to forgive the one who dies in a state of disbelief (for it belies what Allah revealed).

      It is clear that if these two groups were sincere to their methodology, they would necessarily not only speak out against each other, but they would have to make takfeer on one another. The Sunnis have always deemed those who claim Allah occupies space, or has body parts, or changes as a non-Muslim. The Prophet only taught one belief in the Eternal Creator. You simply can’t reconcile the Sunni belief that Allah is clear of time, place, and direction with the claim (the lie) that Allah has organs, limbs, appendages, a smiling face, and sits down inside of a location. As for the so-called Salafis, they deem the mainstream Muslims kaafir for making tawassul (asking Allah by the virtue of the righteous Muslims) and tabarruk (seeking blessings thru the traces of the righteous). These two points are the rationale the Wahhabis employed to go on a wholesale massacre of the Muslims in Medinah, Taa’if, and starve the Muslims in Mecca in the early 1800’s.

      Regarding Hakim Quick, he was what some used to call the “Afrocentric Wahhabi”–although it seems he’s toned it down over the years. For one, you can’t do a historical study of Islam in Africa and not come to the conclusion that the Muslims of Africa were not following the anthropomorphic doctrines of the Wahhabis (to the contrary, they are Ash`aris), and that Islam spread thru Africa largely by way of the Sufi tariqahs. Also, in a video Hakim Quick did, he has a scene where there are WOMEN visiting the graves to seek blessings of some of those who are said to be among the awliyaa’. He doesn’t make any objection to that–although, the Wahhabis consider such an act kufr. In-sha’ Allah, i hope he’s changed–but it makes no sense that if he did for him to join Al-Maghrib.

      In summary, unity is based upon sincerity–that is, sincerity to Allah and unity is based upon seeking to defend the Deen from corruption. These various factions have been willing to put aside CORE DIFFERENCES IN CREED(S) in order to attract large numbers of people (and to make A LOT of loot). If we wish to get united, we need to get down to what the core issues/differences are (primarily those related to `Aqidah), establish what is correct and warn against and expose those who are wrong. Until these alleged leaders are willing to that (and fix their mistakes), then we shouldn’t forget what Cheryl Benard laid out in her Rand Report article on how to undermine Islam.

      With Allah is the success.

      swarthmoor.wordpress.com

    2. hamida September 10th, 2009 at 5:46 pm

      mashallah excited…. i wonder when his first class will be hopefully *gasp* in my town – thnx for sharing the great news with Zaytuna and Bayyinah future expansions and now ALMaghrib new addition.. seeking ilm here in north america will reach a whole new level.

      like my friend here swarthmoor has nicely said

      with Allah s.w.t there is success

    3. Hamza21 September 10th, 2009 at 9:24 pm

      I don’t know what to think with this move by Maghrib. Is Maghrib moving closer towards Sunni Mainstream (Not likely) or Shaykh Quick is moving back towards Salafism? Is this a purely economic move by the Shaykh Quick? Either way I’m very suspicious of moves made by Maghrib , with it’s salafis leanings and promoting (selling) NLP type coaching to their students (who in turn try to hard sell these “coaching” services to NLP unaware students).

      @Swarthmoor

      As Salamu Alaykum wa Ramadan Mubarak

      Now brother you know you have taken some of things out of context. the “children of Allah” statement by a scholar was unfortunate and shouldn’t have been said once nonetheless more than once but you know the scholar wasn’t using that phrase in way you portrayed. It’s obvious by the scholars work for many years he doesn’t subscribe to belief that human beings are literally “children of Allah”. It was expression to convey that we as muslims need to live up to what Quran commands.

      As far as a “scholar” said in one of his books that it is not important for African-American Muslims to study the matters of `Aqidah. ” I believe you took that comment out context. I haven’t read his book fully but I’ve read some of it on google books and the sense I got was he making a point of some AA Muslims focusing on every small detail of aqidah but not focusing on understanding and living Islam fully moral way. He was saying these people instead focusing on trying find fault with other muslims instead they should focus on one’s morals and behavior.

      And although the scholar oversaw Wesley Muhammad’s (NOI) dissertation he never said he supported Welsey’s cocnclusions. As a traditional scholar maybe He would have refuted his student’s views but as university professor I’m not sure he has that leanway. PHd’s ,I believe, are awarded by committe’s decison not by just one professor and the decision doesn’t have be unanimous. The way islam is viewed by western academia I not surprised Welsey was awarded his phd.

    4. Hamza21 September 11th, 2009 at 4:05 pm

      @ al suyuufi

      As salaam Alykum was ramadaan Mubarak

      You must not travel the muslm blogosphere that enough or you would heard of Swarthmoor before. He’s no sufi. Just google “swarthmoor muslim” and you’ll find many of his comments on other fourms and blogs.

    5. Mo September 13th, 2009 at 5:31 am

      Just what oblivious muslims without the commitment to study islam traditionally but willing to part cash in small installments need – another Cash Cow Islamic youtube Peace Tv lecturer selling short courses inflating egos of the misinformed who belong to a deviant sponsored corrupt Saudi Wahabi alliance poisioning minds with faulty aqaid and enforcing a false perspective of history with the same old story – deviant Ashaari Sufi grave worshipping bidati motherfuckers.

    6. Swarth Moor September 13th, 2009 at 12:35 pm

      Just a few points of clarification:

      Tasawwuf (“Sufism”) is a confirmed branch of Islamic science. That’s not to say pseudo-sufis with corrupt creeds or quasi-traditionalist apologists who quote sufi texts don’t exist. Nonetheless, anyone familiar with Islamic scholarship and history knows that an untold number of genuine scholars of Ahlus-Sunnah were adherents of tasawwuf, such as, Hasan al-Basri, Dhun-Nun Al-Misri, Imam An-Nawawi, Ibn Khaldun, Tajud-Deen As-Subki, Ibn `Abideen, and of course, Ibn Ata’illah, and `Uthman Dan Fodio. Check the curricula of various Islamic institutions thru the ages–sufism was (and is) and indispensable part. The Wahhabis, with their revisionist history (and their ludicrous tibia, feet, and eye worshipping doctrine) have put forth an effort to collectively slander Sufism (without being fair and making a distinction between pseudo-sufi deviants and the self-same Sufi scholars that they (the Wahhabis) quote from extensively).

      Secondly, no God-fearing and sincere Muslim, much less anyone who has ever studied the chapters written on apostasy (especially, one familiar with the books written by the Maliki scholars on the topic) would NEVER use the phrase “children of Allah.” The Malikis (and others) said the statement is kufr even if the person did not mean it literally. Aboveall, in the Qur’an, Allah cursed the Christians and Jews for referring to themselves as the “sons of Allah”–although they did not mean that they were Allah’s literal offspring. Personally, i don’t think it was a coincidence that this phrase (a`udhu billah) was used TWICE in Obama’s Egyptian speech. It seems to me these quasi-traditionalists have an agenda to slowly feed the Muslim masses poisonous ideas.

      Thirdly, ordering the good and forbidding the evil is part of the Deen. If people are taking as their “scholars” personalities who will outright LIE and deny what is part of the Religion, then they simply can’t be trusted. If you have a person who will just straight up deny the existence of the Hurul-Ayn, because it is something that is not acknowledged by Western materialists, then this person has OBVIOUSLY exposed himself–and shown that he is not trustworthy (that’s besides the fact it is kufr to belie the Qur’an).

      I sincerely suggest to folks to read Cheryl Benard’s (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheryl_Benard): Rand Report piece on Democratic Partners in Islam. Then look at where these (so-called) “scholars” for dollars fall on the Benardian spectrum. These so-called scholars are MUTE on the matters of apostasy. Do they unambiguously make takfeer on anyone?!? Consequently, they say all sorts of absurd statements, and no one (except for some of the more extreme Wahhabis) are challenging them. The next thing you know, these quasi-traditionalist apologists will be including Louis Farrakhan and Malachi York among the “Muslims.”

    7. Unfortunate September 13th, 2009 at 12:37 pm

      Salam,

      I was unfortunate to read this thread, with curse words especially. It’s unbelievable this can be said especially now. MR, some of these comments should be deleted.

      Yes, I agree al-Maghrib is a Salafi/Wahabi institution, and it is unfortunate that this type of dawah is spreading which is against Ahl-Sunnah, and the young who do not know any better are simply following what they think is the truth. But one must put things in perspective. There is still a lot of good with these programs.

    8. Amatullah September 13th, 2009 at 12:56 pm

      SubhanAllah.

      I wonder if you all will be pleased with your ‘arguments’ and ‘claims’ in your grave…Or on the Day of Judgment.

      Do something beneficial with your time that will bring you closer to Allah. i.e., get a life.

    9. Usman September 14th, 2009 at 9:39 pm

      The house is on fire and we’re arguing instead of trying to put the fire out.

      There is SO much work to do – let’s stop arguing and get to work.

      Teach a class, organize a youth event, do something.

      Al Maghrib and Zaytuna are both doing something and inspiring Muslims Alhamdulilah.

      Let’s get to work!

    10. Swarth Moor September 15th, 2009 at 11:44 am

      Usman,

      The Qur’an says:

      You are the best of Nations brought forth to the people, for you enjoin the good and forbid the evil.” (3: 110)

      Ordering the good and forbidding the evil IS part of teaching people. If you do not warn against kufr, then against what does one speak out against?!? There is a MAJOR problem here that people are ominously silent about: the Sunnis consider the corporeal/anthropomorphic Wahhabi doctrine (such as, what is taught by Al-Maghrib Institute) to be unadulterated kufr. The Wahhabis (so-called Salafis) teach that Allah is a giant smiling faced entity with a tibia, fingers, eyes, travels about in the shadows of clouds, mounts (or sits in person on) the `Arsh, moves up and down thru the Heavens throughout a 24 hour period, etc. The Sunnis say Allah is the Creator of space, direction, time, and is not in space, direction or time–or any other dimension. Allah does not have organs or limbs or appendages. Allah does not change. Allah ABSOLUTELY does not resemble anything.

      Furthermore, the Wahhabis (quasi-salafis)–those “sincere” to following the teachings of their founder–have to deem the masses of Muslims “kaafir”–as the founder of that sectarian movement did. This is why the Wahhabis went on their murderous rampages in the Hijaaz (region of Mecca and Madinah) 200 years ago. The Wahhabis deem those who make tawassul or seek tabarruk from the the Prophet and the the Righteous Muslims as mushrikeen (which is NOT the case–for the Prophet ordered people to seek tabarruk by his traces and to make tawassul). What you have here are two groups with two different notions about who the Creator of the Heavens and Earth is (and two different notions about what constitutes kufr). You can’t have “unity” with people who have two different notions of “tawheed.” Even the “sincere” Wahhabis (in spite of their warped creed) can understand this, and that is why they deem one of the former Maghrib institute teachers a big time deviant.

      With that said, it should be EVIDENT that this thing is a money grab (like dem preachers up in dem negro churches). Anyone CLAIMING to follow the Maliki school would IMMEDIATELY make takfeer on those who claim Allah has a giant smiling face and lives somewhere above our heads. Strangely (or not so strangely, if you read Benard’s piece), these quasi-Sunni Malikis are telling people NOT to discuss the matters of kufr and apostasy–even if the kufr is blatant and apparent (to anyone who has studied tradtional knowledge). Instead, these people have invented a whole new definition of what it means to be a Sunni Muslim–or even what is required to be saved in the Hereafter. A person who prays to a giant (imaginary) spatial entity that laughs, goes up and down, has two comparatively small feet and 10-12 comparatively small fingers, or sits down upon or mounts objects is NOT a Muslim. This is what the classical scholars said (such as, An-Nawawi, Qadi `Iyad, At-Tahawi, Abu Mansur Al-Baghdadi, Imam Ahmad, etc.). It is an OBLIGATION to advise people with such convictions to repent of their kufr AND to warn others against such a belief. If you are sincere you DO NOT make agreements with the mujassimah (body-worshippers) that you will not warn others of their misguidance and disbelief.

      Add to that, that these quasi-traditionalists have all sorts of deviant statements coming from them, such as, saying people are the “children of Allah,” claiming Muslims should love the kaafir, or that murder interupts the appointed death time, or the Hur-ul-Ayn are figurative, or outright denying and rejecting verses of the Qur’an, ad nauseum, and it becomes clear that there are some folks who are trying to lead the Muslim masses to the slaughter house. May Allah endow us with the courage to stand up and expose these deviants and this great evil that is infecting the minds of so many Muslims today. May Allah give us the strength NEVER to leave ordering the good and forbidding the evil.

      With Allah is the success.

    11. The Ghazzali Blogger September 15th, 2009 at 1:06 pm

      @Swarth Moor
      I agree that we have to enjoy the good and forbid the evil. I do not know what side of the argument you’re on. All I understand is that you are picking faults out form both side and have a problem with the Unity pledge that was signed in NA.

      One must realize the Unity pledge DOES NOT mean we let these debates die out. Rather it means the debates will remain amongst the scholars for them to debate about and the students will take no part in it. And the students should learn from ALL the different institutions. IF you noticed since the signing of the pledge Sheikh Yasir Qadhi has toned down his light upon light class.

      However we still need to forbid the evil. THE BEST WAY TO FORBID THE EVIL is by NOT arguing scholarly debate between OURSELVES because we are no scholars. Rather ALLOW the scholars ot sit and debate and when they reach a verdict to tell the rest of us. One great evil is that the laymen get involved in scholarly debate and hinder the scholars from coming up with a unanimous conclusion. What we do is only pick faults of our scholars which is an evil on itself.

      The best way of enjoying good and forbidding evil is to understand what Imam Ghazali meant when he said,

      “If those who do not possess knowledge avoid scholarly discussusions, disagreements will end.”

      because then the Ummah will be united on TRUTH.

    12. Swarth Moor September 15th, 2009 at 2:21 pm

      @Ghazali,

      I am showing that NEITHER side can be considered trustworthy (neither the pseudo-salafis nor the quasi-traditionalists)–and they CERTAINLY can’t be considered “scholars.” It is a PERONAL OBLIGATION to know that Allah does not resemble the creation, and that includes knowing that Allah does not have real actual literal organs, limbs, and appendages, and that Allah does not occupy space. And it is a personal obligation to know that those who claim Allah does resemble the creation are kuffaar. I don’t need folks to form a council to inform me on the basics of my `Aqidah.

      I am not a scholar, but praise Allah, i have learned enough to know that people who just outright deny verses of the Qur’an, claim that murder interupts a person’s predestined deathtime, or claim that the Hurul-`Ayn are figurative are also REMOTE from being scholars (or Muslims). And certainly, those who claim Allah has a giant smiling face and tibia are not scholars (or Muslims). To the contrary, to claim the above is kufr… by the sayings of genuine classical scholars of Ahlus-Sunnah. Simply possessing some ijaazahs does not mean that the person might not “flip the script” and start teaching kufr embellished in flowery speech.

      What you have going on here is a scam. You have these self-appointed “scholars,” who have told the Muslim laity that it isn’t their job to make a distinction between kufr and Imaan. Go to the classical books on `Aqidah; therein they mention details of what constitutes kufr… and you know what… these very (alleged) “scholars” are openly guilty of the kufr that is mentioned in those books. Instead, these “popes” are suppose to tell us the distinction… but then you never hear them discuss the topic–or mention what is in the classical books on the topic of kufr/riddah. Where are the documents from these quasi-traditionalists mentioning those various kufri beliefs and other matters that nullify one’s Islam–especially, those which are widespread and prevalent in this time? Shouldn’t that be among the GREATEST PRIORITES given all the confusion pertaining to matters of `Aqidah? You have people (who call themselves Muslim) who believe all sorts of blasphemous beliefs, such as, Allah is a light, or literally/physically everywhere, or that Allah is located above the `Arsh or inside the First Heaven, or that Allah literally unites with the pious, or that the Christians and Jews will be saved in the Hereafter, or that it is permisible to make jokes about the Allah or to put the Qur’an in the trash, or to delay giving someone the Shahadah, or to assist others to commit kufr, etc. These (alleged) “scholars” know what is in the classical books (especially, if one claims to be a Maliki), and they know the kinds of misconceptions that are prevalent in the West… yet… they say little or nothing on the topic.

      Not only that, these (alleged) “scholars” oppose the scholarly tradition they claim to follow regarding the matters of kufr/apostasy. These people are NOT scholars… but they have an agenda. This is CLEARLY a money thing (and something more diabolical). The more people who attend their conferences, the more money they clock. Now if these alleged “scholars” were to rightfully stand up and warn people that such and such beliefs are kufr (i.e., beliefs held by some of the people at their conferences), then that will cause division, and if they are divided, that means smaller conferences, and smaller conferences means less $$$$$$$$. So much for sincerity. Now if one claims to love Muslims, and you know that there are people spreading poisonous kufri beliefs in the cloak of Islam, then it behooves you to say something. You will find these “scholars” deafeningly silent when it comes to ordering the good and forbidding the evil in the matters of `Aqidah–in spite of all the confusion and misconceptions prevailing in Muslim communities. I didn’t just fall off the watermelon truck the other day. I can see when people are getting played, and i am sure i am not the only one here who sees it.

    13. Hamza21 September 16th, 2009 at 2:28 pm

      “Nonetheless, these same “rock stars” have made claims, such as:

      —-”the Hurul-`Ayn” (Virgins of Paradise) are figurative, ”

      @ Swarthmoor

      At first I didn’t know whom you were refering to investigating this matter I believe you were refering to Shaykh Hamza. However the Shaykh has clarified this issued back in 2001.

      “Now, Allah says about jannah that it is something no eye has seen, and it never occurred to the human heart. So, when you look at the other descriptions of paradise in the Qur’an, you have to know that those are approximations. Do not think that Allah is describing physical types of things that we know of in this world. That is what Imam Al-Ghazali said, and that is what the ‘ulama say. One of the things that some people are trying to use against Islam is that they say we envision paradise as being this type of sexual romp or something like that, which is a terrible thing. For the human being, the highest level of pleasure is in sexual relations, and therefore, it would be appropriate, according to what Imam Al-Ghazali says, to give some indication of the pleasures of paradise by talking about something that human beings know about, which is that experience, because the majority of human beings do not have intense mystical experiences in their life. There are mystics who do have these experiences that are very profound and intense, but most people do not. The most intense experience that they will have of pleasure is in this act, and when Allah describes the pleasures of paradise, He uses those examples because they are close to people’s understandings.

      That is not to say that hur al-‘ain do not exist because they are real. However, to think that they are somehow related to the bestial elements of this world is incorrect. Allah says that these are pure beings. Paradise is total purity, so, it is about purity; its not about anything that relates to the mud of this world; that is euros.”

      http://www.witness-pioneer.org/vil/Articles/issues/us_tragedy_islamic_view_qa.htm

    14. Concerned September 16th, 2009 at 5:20 pm

      @ Swarth Moor:
      Your hatred towards Shaykh Hamza is loud & clear. However, you are not the only one, just another person who has too much time on their hand and actually think you are enjoining good & forbidding evil! I ask you, if you sincerely care what Shaykh Hamza has to say, please make dua that Allah guide him on the straigh path while you pray tonight (the 27th night of Ramadan).

    15. QasYm September 16th, 2009 at 8:03 pm

      MR, please delete some of these posts. It’s funny that “Shaykh” Swarth moor has issues with everyone’s posts except that one who used curse words in his. Maybe cause he was doin the same.

      The Prophet (saw) said if one person calls another a kaafir, then one of them truly is one. The majority of muslims would admit that the people being accused of kufr by “Maulana” Swarth moor are not kaafir, so that leaves…

      wasalam

    16. also September 17th, 2009 at 12:26 am

      I think people have a lot of nerve to so bravely talk about God. Whether or not Allah swt has hands, and how He has them, is something for Him to know. All we know is there is nothing like Him. We shouldn’t try to limit Him by saying “yes He has this” or “no He doesn’t have this”, Allah is beyond anything we can imagine.

      And I hate it when “enjoin the good and forbid the evil” is the only verse some people know. There happen to be other verses in the Qur’an as well. And there happen to be a lot of prerequisites one must fulfill before acting on that verse. Slandering or backbiting people on a blog.. may not be the best way to go about it.

      This is my problem with “short ‘aqeeda intensives”. People learn a little ‘aqeedah and run with it.

      May Allah swt forgive us all.

    17. The Ghazzali Blogger September 17th, 2009 at 12:44 am

      @QasYm
      Actually the we don’t even KNOW verse “enjoin the good and forbid the evil”

      Why?
      because we only practice half of it.

      Notice enjion the good comes first. Why? because it is more important. When we help eachother to ibaadat then the bad AUTOMATICALLY goes away. For example you’re on the subway and it is filled with provocative women and you need to lower your gaze. However if you read Quran and try to memorize it on the subway (you’re enjoining good) your eyes are already away form them.
      But Muslims tend to only follow half that ayat and the less important half at that too

      Completely agree with you on the aqeedah intensives. I think they do more harm than good. My evidence? Well look at Yasir Qadhi’s MAC v. PC post. People said they were about to burn books if YAsir Qadhi became an Ashari. However for most those peopel the first mention of the word aqeedah WAS from YAsir Qadhi.

      @Swarth
      FURTHERMORE
      The teachers we have in the west. They have sacrificed A LOT. And they make NO money. Zaid and Hamza both have made their Zaytuna salaries public. Even their book sales go back to their students. Even when you invite them to MSA they just ask for travel fees. So with what EVIDENCE do you judge their INTENTIONS. (Them or Al-Maghrib teachers.)

      Oh and only the mutazilites said Allah was everywhere. And BOTH Zaytuna and AL-Maghreb said this is a MAJOR wrong.

    18. Swarth Moor September 17th, 2009 at 12:07 pm

      @ Hamza,

      When HY is asked about the Hurul-Ayn, he says in the interview, “they are figurative.” The guy is an equivocator and a liar. Point blank. Is it not clear to folks that games are being played here? If he is going to straight up lie on national TV, don’t you think he is going to lie elsewhere? The guy has made SO MANY mistakes, that it is clear he’s not a scholar–or even someone who can be trusted to teach the Deen.

      @ Concerned

      Folks need to chill out on their Kool Aid consumption. Do you not consider the POSSIBILITY that this guy is on someone’s payroll–especially, after 9/11?!? The guy has made A LOT of errors in the matters of `Aqidah…. and i don’t know him to speak out against deviant factions (that are prominent today). How is he helping Muslims if he does not warn the Muslims against the kufr of the Wahhabis or these pseudo-sufis? He KNOWS the kind of deviance out there, but he is virtually silent. He knows that if he spoke out against these factions, the people would gobble it up out of his hand. Instead, he’s hanging out with anthropomorphists, and does warn against their evil.

      @Also

      Literal “hands” are body parts. Allah is not a body and Allah is not composed of parts. That is why we say: “Qul Huwa Allahu Ahad.” The Name of Allah, “Al-Ahad,” means that Allah is One in the sense of being Absolutely Unique; One in the sense of there being no other Creator or associate with Him; and One in the meaning that Allah is Indivisble (not a body) and not composed of pieces or parts. That obviously means that Allah is not a bipedal entity and does not occupy space, or have two hands, one tibia, a pair of eyes, or 10-12 fingers.

      The phrase “bi-laa kayf” means: “with NO how.” It does NOT mean “without KNOWING how.” Howness/modality (“kayfiyyah”) is inapplicable to Allah, just as temperature, color, scent, mass, motion, size, etc. are inapplicable to Allah, for Allah REALLY does not resemble the creations.

      About Also,

      This is EXACTLY what i am talking about. There are A LOT of people contaminated by this Wahhabi doctrine. HY KNOWS this to be the case. Why does he not warn people? The mass of people will take from him (i.e, accept what he says). If HY informed the people that the one who believes that Allah occupies space, or has a size, or limbs or organs has commited kufr, needs to reject that belief, and say the Shahadah, they would accept. How can you claim to be about “loving the Muslims” or “purifying the heart,” but be silent about the spread of this filthy anthropomorphic shirk doctrine of the Wahhabis (or pseudo-sufis)?!? Again, it is clear as day, the guy has another agenda.

      @ Ghazali Blogger

      The one who believes Allah is literally everywhere has not only made a major mistake, he’s commited kufr. He’s not praying to Allah–he’s praying to something that is in the dog kennel, the hog slaughter house, and in the sewage. (I’m not talking about Allah knowing everything everywhere–but literally occupying all places.) The Wahhabis obviously don’t believe that Allah is everywhere. They say such a belief is kufr, for it contradicts their (invalid/kufri) belief that Allah is either mounting the `Arsh or down in the First Heaven. Regarding HY, i know that one of the Brothers here approached HY to get clarity on what he meant by a statement he made on the `Aqidah. The Brother said to him, “Isn’t better just to say Allah exists without being in a location?” He said, HY refused to give a straight answer. That’s typical.

      Now on a recent video, HY claims that during the Isra’ and Al-Mi`raj, that the Prophet (sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam) went up to the “presence of Allah.” That seems to be something the Wahhabis at AlMaghrib would teach. God knows what he meant by that statement, but why would any sincere Sunni use such a phrase, when HE KNOWS that there are LOTS of people calling themselves Muslims who believe Allah is literally located above the `Arsh? If anything, you would mention the truth of this matter (that the Prophet came in proximity to Angel Jibreel–and not Allah, and that above the `Arsh Allah empowered the Prophet to understand Allah’s Kalaam (just as Allah empowered Musa to understand Allah’s Kalaam on Mount Sinai) but it did not mean that Allah was literally there in a location above the `Arsh). You would then go on to warn the people against this prevalent and dangerous misconception that is being spread nowadays. That would take all of five minutes. Something waaaaaaay ain’t right when you KNOW there is a lot of confusion on `Aqidah and a lot of people spreading heretical and blasphemous beliefs, but the person remains silent about these matters.

      It’s ironic you would mention the Mu`tazilah, for HY is the one who claimed that “murder is such a heinous crime, for it interupts a person’s preappointed time of death.” (That’s the same BBC interview in which HY calls the kaafir firefighters killed on 9/11 “martyrs.”) Having one’s predestined lifespan interupted is the Mu`tazilah creed–not the creed of Ahlus-Sunnah. The Muslims say that NOTHING hinders what Allah has willed.

      @ Whomever

      I am just curious, does HY teach anything from Baabur-Riddah (the chapter on Apostasy)? Does he mention some of the blasphemous beliefs (or practices) that are widespread in the Muslim communities today? I am not talking about the long convoluted piece written wherein he can’t unequivocally define who a kaafir is. I am curious, does he teach (with details) the chapter of apostasy from any well-known Maliki (or other) text? I remember in one lecture he said, almost as an aside: “You know that some of the `ulamaa’ said that if one wears the sash of the Chrisitian clergymen and goes and mixes amongst the Christians, that this is kufr.” Until i heard him say that, for a long time, i thought that the guy was just ignorant of the matters of apostasy. (Although i did find that hard to swallow, for he is allegedly a Maliki, and the Malikis wrote EXTENSIVELY on the matters of kufr/apostasy. (Qadi `Iyad’s Ash-Shifa has more than 50 pages devoted to matters of apostasy alone.)) It’s evident the guy KNOWS what the traditional scholars have said about apostasy, but he doesn’t inform his followers–for that would mean deeming a large number of the people he hangs out with as apostates.

      Again, i know i am not the only person here who has some suspicion regarding what is going on. Look at the Cheryl Benard piece, and then look to see who it is that fits the profile. It ain’t the folks at Troid, and it ain’t really Irshad Manji (she’ just a diversion). We need to look into our history and understand the depth that the opponents of Islam have gone to attack the Deen–take a look at Kemalian Turkey, the Freemasons in Egypt, the Wahhabis and later T.E. Lawerence in Arabia, the apologists of India, ad nauseum. Why would one think anything would be different in America? Instead, it would be the same ole same ole–except the opponents of Islam have gotten more sophisticated.

      With Allah is the success.

      Strangely you should mention the Mu`tazila, when HY said: “Murder is such a heinous crime for it interupts the person’s predestined deathtime.”

    19. QasYm September 18th, 2009 at 1:58 am

      If a man calls his Muslim brother kafir, it applies to one of the two.” (Bukhari)

    20. Swarth Moor September 18th, 2009 at 10:54 am

      QasYm,

      If a person makes an explicit kufri statement, you have to deem the person a kaafir. I know that you have this anti-takfeeri movement amongst these quasi-traditionalists, and they love to quote the above Hadith without putting it into context. The quasi-traditionalists quote the Hadith without teaching their followers–at all–the matters related to apostasy. The traditional scholars mentioned MANY beliefs (or sayings) that are kufr. They weren’t afraid to call those guilty of explicit kufr “kaafir.”

      It’s evident that there are some (or many) people calling themselves Muslims who are not. Wesley Muhammad claims that Allah is the Asiatic blackman. He wrote his Ph. D. dissertation on this topic (that one one of the quasi-traditionalists signed off on). I don’t need to consult a scholar to judge Wesley Muhammad (or anyone else with such a belief) as a kaafir. To the contrary, to doubt that such a belief is kufr is itself kufr.

      What happened is that you had the Qutbis and some of the Wahhabis indiscriminately making takfeer. They said things like a person is kaafir for voting (not claiming democracy is superior or equal to the Shar`iah–just merely voting). They claimed (and still claim) that if a ruler doesn’t govern completely by Islam, then he’s a kaafir–and that folks must rise up and revolt. They deemed people kuffaar for the sins (less than kufr) that they commit. They revived the doctrine of the Khawarij–and that is why the Wahhabis were referred to as the Khawarij of this era by Ibn `Abideen and other scholars.

      On the other hand, mainstream Ahlus-Sunnah scholars wrote extensively about apostasy–so that the Muslim masses would be warned about it and to avoid it… so that the Muslims would readily distinguish the difference between Imaan and kufr. As i said, Qadi `Iyad’s, Ash-Shifa, has more than FIFTY PAGES listing various kufri beliefs/actions. Muhammad `Ulaysh, a later Maliki wrote a book entirely devoted to the subject. They did this for a reason–so that Muslims wouldn’t dare cross the line between Islam and disbelief. It is among the greatest injustices of these quasi-traditionalists to be silent on the matters of apostasy, when there are so many snares of kufr all around us.

      Once a person studies the subject of apostasy, his eyes become WIDE OPEN to the level of deviance and misguidance that is being published, or on the web, or coming out of the mouths of many of these speakers on the circuit. If a person is praying to a (imaginary) smiling faced bipedal being with eyes, a shin, and fingers, the person isn’t a Muslim. Afterall, you can’t be a Muslim while worshipping other than Allah. If a person claims that Allah is not the Creator of everything, or that Allah does not know everything, or that Allah has not predestined everything again, this person can’t be a Muslim (hence, we don’t claim that murder interupts a person’s predestined lifespan) . Similarly, if a person rejects what he knows to be a part of the Religion, then he can’t be a Muslim. If someone you know has fallen into kufr, you advise the person to abandon his bad conviction and say the Shahadah to return to Islam. You don’t leave him stranded in a state of ignorance and disbelief.

      What you have here is something more insidious: you have people encouraging people NOT to study the subject of Apostasy. Why? Because many of the people these quasi-traditionalists associate with openly commit kufr. Not only that, many of the quasi-traditionalists themselves have commited apostasy, and they don’t want their followers calling them out. Throw in all the loot these folks are making and what Cheryl Benard wrote, and it becomes pretty clear what we are dealing with.

      With Allah is the success.

    21. The Ghazzali Blogger September 19th, 2009 at 12:39 am

      @Swarth Moor
      yea BOTH Al-MAghrib and Zaytuna said whoever says Allah is everywhere is not part of the ahlul Sunnah (meaning they aren’t Muslim) I figured you would use SOME intelligence and understand when I say someone committed a major wrong in aqeedah it means they are committing kufr. (Meaning I AGREE WITH YOU and so does Zaytuna and Al MAghrib) This is a prime example of Muslims not giving their brothers any leeway. OF COURSE I MEANT IT WAS KUFR major mistakes in Aqeedah pretty much are. And ALL of what you have accused BOTH institutions is on the basis that you don’t listen to them rather you just want to accuse people. Al Maghrib never said Allah LITERALLY is on the throne. And if you taken the class you would know that. you can’t give me one exampel where Al-Maghrib said the meaning is literal. (They say what Imam Malik says that the HOW IS UNKNOWN) so how do you accuse Al-Maghrib of being literal?

      Furthermore I don’t care if you answer me on the above. What I care about is your accusation that these people want money. WHAT MONEY does Hamza Yusuf and Zaid Shakir have?? (I dunno how al-maghrib teachers live so I can’t be a witness for them) but I’m sure they have students here that can be a witness that they DON’T make money.

    22. Swarth Moor September 19th, 2009 at 11:34 am

      @Blogger,

      Regarding pantheism, i am GLAD they say that such a belief is kufr. It wouldn’t surprise me that AlMaghrib says so. I know that at least in the past, they used to have lessons on the matters of apostasy. But then you have this phrase “theological tolerance” being thrown around now, in which some of these folks wish to include groups (with kufri bleiefs) amongst the ranks of Ahlus-Sunnah. I see that Wesley Muhammad has even adopted the phrase (presumably from his mentor) and is now trying to use it to include the so-called Nation of Islam’s doctrine as part of classical Islamic theology. (Wesley Muhammad is the character who argues by using the sayings of the quasi-Hanbali anthropomorphists, that since Allah is a man (or manlike) entity, and the original inhabitants of Arabia were black, he says, that means that Allah is a black man.) This is a guy who earned his Ph. D. by writing a dissertation (on that topic), which was that was supervised by one of these quasi-traditionalist.

      One of the students here is a former AlMaghrib victim. He’s confirmed they are Wahhabi anthropomorphists. Regarding current AlMaghrib students, we had a run-in with some of the students at a conference, wherein they said EXPLICITLY Allah is above the `Arsh and that Allah has literal “hands” (and no, they didn’t mean “Power,” or “Control,” “Domination,” etc.). And at one of the former AlMaghrib teachers blog, he recently completed a lengthy article supporting the position that Allah “rose over” the `Arsh. I mentioned that At-Tahawi said:

      “Allah is supremely clear of boundaries, extremities, sides, organs, appendages, and instruments. NONE of the six directions contain Allah, as is the case with all the created things.”

      He responded by saying that At-Tahawi’s Creed was composed after the era of the Salaf, and is less “orthodox” than some of the previous works on `Aqidah by the Salaf (he’s referring to some of the books the Wahhabis have tampered with).

      Regarding the loot, i will politely it throw back at you: how much money are these guys raising?!? You are talking about MILLIONS upon MILLIONS of dollars. Personally, if i see characters who are out right LYING and playing games with people’s `Aqidah, i am DEFINITELY not going to trust them with my cash. These are folks who are CLEARLY not trustworthy. If you have a so-called (male) “scholar” of Islam shaking hands with a woman on national TV, i am NOT going to consider this person brave enough to stand up and defend the Deen of Allah.

      Folks saying, “we are the children of Allah,” or that kaafirs killed in 9/11 are martyrs, or the or that the Prophet will intercede for the kaafirs on the Judgment Day, or calling people “pathological maniacs” for doing what Allah made permissible in the Qur’an, or that the Qur’an does not contain anything anti-Jewish, or claiming you can’t call an open an evident non-Muslim a “kaafir” because you don’t know his future state, or givin’ daps to an adult female–at some point, we have to question what is going on here. If you are not going to teach people the truth (and you KNOW that you are not teaching the people the truth), then what really is your agenda?

      With Allah is the success.

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